This conversation is sponsored by the nice folks at Ebay,who want to remind you and me both that Mother’s Day is coming up next week – May 11th – and at this point in our lives, we should probably be coming up with better Mother’s Day gifts than all those misshapen clay mugs we gave the women who raised us back when we were in elementary school.
Please consider supporting sponsors like Ebay who help keep the lights on here at Mamapundit. Thanks! – Katie
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There is a certain type of iconic “mother of adult children” character that looms large in Americans’ cultural imagination. You know the one; even though her little girl or boy is growing up and moving on, mom can’t let go of her primary identity as “Tyler’s Mom” or “Savannah’s Mom,” and thus, remains hyper-involved and hovering, often to an obsessive and ridiculous degree. This meddling mom-type can definitely be pretty darn entertaining, which is likely why she shows up as a recurring character in all kinds of movies and TV shows and books.
To wit, allow me to introduce you to….Susie’s Mom:
But I wonder, with most women now working full time, and so many moms having to delay retirement due to divorce and the economy, plus the fact that we are having kids when we are older, meaning that lots of us are just ramping our careers back up at about the time that our kids age out of the house, is this hovering mom-type like Susie’s mama in the video a reality any longer? Or is she just a funny, retro throwback who, while still often seen on the screen or in the pages of chick-lit, has in reality become an endangered species, la June Cleaver, Aunt Bea or Carol Brady?
I mean, how many 55 or 62 year old women do you know who have the time to obsess over their adult children’s day to day lives? Even moms of adult children who might want to do things like reorganize the kitchen cabinets in the apartments that their adult children now inhabit are probably too busy paying their own bills or starting a new company or maybe even just enjoying things they couldn’t afford (in time or money) when they were still fully responsible for their offspring.
I also know many 60-70 year old women who have finally retired from their own paid employment, but who are now spending many hours a week providing childcare so that their daughters and daughters in law can earn a living (my own amazing and wonderful mother in law Janice falls into that category). That doesn’t leave much time for meddling and interfering either. After six or eight hours of taking care of her grandchildren, your average 60-something woman with her own life and interests isn’t going to want to do anything but get away from her adult child’s household and concerns so that she can go spend some time enjoying her own.
My oldest daughter, J will be a senior in high school in the fall. And then, if she’s anything like I was, after May of 2013, she will never really live at home with me again. Although I was close to my parents and family, I couldn’t wait to get out there into the world and do my own thing. At that point – I was her oldest – my mom still had what ended up being 25 more years of a very demanding, full time career in journalism and PR ahead of her. She only retired two years ago. For my mother, me leaving the house to go to college meant one less kid at home to supervise and oversee, and that meant more ability for her to focus more intently on her work, having put that off to some degree during the years she had to divide her focus and daily logistical capabilities between mothering and career.
So here are my questions I’d love to discuss in this run-up to Mother’s Day; is the era of the over involved, meddling mother of adult children over? Have changing societal expectations and economic conditions fundamentally changed what mothers’ 50s, 60s and even 70s look like? Did this specific mothering archetype ever really exist to any significant degree, or does her ubiquitous representation in all kinds of media and entertainment reflect some kind of secret longing that we all have for a mom would would have the time and interest and ability to come camp out at our apartments or houses and spoon feed us homemade chicken soup when we are sick – even if we are 25 or 35 years old? Do any of you reading this know or have a mom like this in real life? And what about you? How do you anticipate your role in your kids’ lives evolving once they are living on their own?
Tell me what you think, and I will do the same. Let’s talk moms of adult kids (because soon, I will be one!)
My youngest child graduates high school on May 24. My older two sons are at college and will be home for the summer in the next few weeks. I have no idea how next year will be. I have always worked full time so I have fitted in motherhood around that. But my life has really revolved around the boys and their many, time consuming activities. I hope I will take up new hobbies or rediscover old ones. Maybe go back to school when they're all out of college and we can afford it (ha!). I have not hovered or helicoptered over the two at college now and pray I'll spare my "baby" as well. I fear, though, I won't ever find anything so fulfilling and fun as being with my boys. I recently read a book where the author mentions that on her deathbed the author's mother asks, "but who will take care of you and Jim?" She and her brother Jim were both in their 60s at the time. I'm not sure if that should be a cautionary tale or not. I hope people who have successfully made the transition will have advice!
Ok, these are all great questions, but I have to say, this made me laugh out loud:
"I also know many 60-70 year old women who…are now spending many hours a week providing childcare so that their daughters and daughters in law can earn a living… That doesn’t leave much time for meddling and interfering either."
Except, of course, for the "many hours a week" they have the opportunity to "parent" those grandchildren! That's a fantastic opportunity to meddle! You get to pick how to discipline the children, you get to pick what to feed the children, you get to pick how to entertain the children…
I'm 49 and my mother still hovers. When I am around her I feel like I'm sixteen again….and that's not a good thing.
As for me and my children, I so enjoy the empty nest. The freedoms of less worry….Oh I still worry, but there is now shared responsibility. They are responsible for themselves (though I will always be there)
Yes, empty nesting is the life for me.
In re-reading what I already wrote, I hope I don't sound like parents can't or shouldn't be involved and helpful with their adult children. I certainly want and plan to be that. I just think this cultural archetype of the meddling middle aged (or older) mom (always mom, never a dad) doesn't really represent the way we live any longer. And did it ever? I dunno…
As a former college administrator in Student Affairs who is still very connected to that field, I have to assure you that there are PLENTY of those moms and dads hovering just like that. The amount of parent phone calls to discuss roommate issues, class assignments, hiring decisions in student employment, you name it, can be overwhelming. And it's not just for major issues, which I can completely nderatand, but I have had multiple emails and calls from parents who were competing their student's employment firms online and couldn't remember the password they created for their student's account. One of my former students even took his mom to his company's orientation for new hires, and this was with a prestigious consulting company. I think some moms choose not to return to the workforce and continue to parent like their kids are still at home. Technology makes this even easier. Underestimating, I'd say at least 75% of my students spoke to their parents at least every other day and texted/emailed/FBed their parents daily, a far cry from the weekly check ins I remember. And the dads are just as connected! I think they're just not as publicized… Generally, it seemed like conversations arose between mom and student, then dad was notified to call or email the school. It was all bizarrely retro. This was at four different schools with varying demographics. Definitely more pronounced at the small religiously affiliated school, but not uncommon at the large private urban schools either.
Like you, once I left my family home, I was gone forever. I don't see that happening as much with young adults these days. It's hard for them to find jobs that can keep them self sufficient and many of them do have good options and a great lifestyle when they come back home to mom and dad. If you live near a major city where the job prospects are decent, your kids are very likely to return to be near you and to get some financial help, not necessarily directly, as they live through those early struggling year getting on their feet.
The transition to independence is a tough one for kids these days, used to a pretty good standard of living. It also seems to me that the beasts of mental illnesses are uncaged more, and just the way society and life styles are, it's easier for young people to get into trouble. Trouble with the laws, substance abuse, sex, relationships, money, it just seems more prevalent. Also those kids going off to college, at least in the NE, are not marrying at the early ages that we were. I thought I was late in marriage and children, but not at all. I had kids by the time I was my oldest one's age as did his father. Even my older kids do not have prospects of marriage right now, and few of their peers do either. Most of the moms of my kids friends and peers are still not grandmothers. I am going to be a very old grandmother, if I even make it there.
Y'all raising some very good insights that actually make a pretty good case that in opposition to my own theory, maybe moms of adult kids are actually MORE likely to be hyper involved in the details of their offspring's lives than in decades past. Hmmm…. Social media, cell phones and texting have definitely made a fundamental shift in how often and in what level of detail parents and their adult kids are communicating with one another, and that's a huge part of the equation. I wonder, though, if the issue shakes out differently if you look at parents of college age kid separately from parents of kids, say, 24 and over. Thoughts?
Yup, I have to go with your re-think. Most parents with kids in college or older seem to have FAR more contact with them than was common when I was in college and working. My mom called once a week and that was more than a lot of other people I knew. Now, many moms talk with their kids at least once a day in addition to texting. Or just living with them still!
I'd say that the day of the helicopter parent is still alive and well. If anything, perhaps due to economic conditions, I'd say that even for older than 24 kids, there's still more contact.
In my area, the kids are not growing up as fast. Even out of college, with jobs, they are hanging around the family home more as are their peers. Again, this is just my little corner of the world. By the time they are out of college, I think a lot of us moms are ready to have them live their own lives. I blame myself for my kids being less independent than I like. I don't think I gave them the send off that I should have.
Ironically, I am seeing a lot of the families I know who are fundametalists with kids perhaps not going to college and who were more cloistered at home as children, are the ones that are truly on their own. A lot of them are married with children of their own and they are truly self subsisting adults with their own familes.
In my case, I am dealing with distinct "failures to launch" and I wonder if I have enabled this. I don't have any answers and would love to hear some theories. I am not pleased with this stage of my adult children at all.
trust me when i tell you, hovering mothers (or mother-in-law in my case) are alive, well and still meddling. my husband's mother is relentless; giving unsolicited advice whenever possible, dropping by without calling and crossing every boundary there is to cross. luckily, my husband handles her well and is able to keep her at arms length and we all live in peace (most of the time). i also knew exactly what i was getting into when entering into this relationship and eyes wide open, jumped into marriage knowing i was about to have a very difficult in-law. your essay hits home on many levels; because even though she was a registered nurse prior to having children, she chose to never go back to any type of work at all. no judgement, i swear, but i do think that is why she is so attached to her children. i shudder to think what would have happened had my husband been an only child. i don't necessarily think you have to go back to having a typical career, but i think you have to actively seek out your own identity as an empty nester. my mother in law's entire world is her children and her identity is ensconced as a mother. she has crippled one of her children with her own incessant meddling. my husband is unscathed, thank god, but he still has issues that are totally the product of overzealous parenting. i often wonder what kind of impact that had / has on her marriage. sadly, i have to admit that when we have our own children, her own helicopter parenting will have to change or she'll be around them far less than she wishes. the silver lining? i'm never at a shortage of stories for girl's nights.
My mother-in-law was absolutely one of those hovering mothers.
I was the same way… left home and never looked back, but I would appreciate some sort of involvement now that I am a parent.
Neither one of us, hubby or self, have very involved parents… I honestly wish the either my husband's or my parents were a little more involved with our lives and the grandkid.
I hear stories of all our friends who have parents who come over and help pick-up maybe do a load of laundry, take the kids out for ice-cream… ours are more like you described, focused on a 2nd career of sorts or hobbies.
Being in a town away from my mom… I'd love it if my husband's parents were meddling, had an opinion and were involved. It's like pulling eye teeth to get them involved and they often turn us down for activities.
On the opposite of this though, my husband has an adult brother who is in his 30's and unmarried. He pretty much does everything with his parents and they do everything for him. He lived at home forever and finally moved out and got a roommate, but still depends on them for everything. They have crippled him from being on his own… he can't seem to function without them.
So, I guess if I had to pick between how they act with us versus my brother-in-law… I would rather have them not bee too involved!!!
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I also think that lives are just different…. I don't ever remember any of my grandmothers working while they were alive and all of our adult parents are still working. My mom is divorced, single and has lost her job 3 times in the last 5 years… she's had it rough, so she's so focused on her own survival to be meddling and giving opinions on our lives.
Very interesting to read the comments…and this post!
Did you hear this report when it aired on NPR? http://www.npr.org/2012/02/06/146464665/helicopte…
The meddlers exist. My parents aren't among them though–I'm in my late 20s and live on the opposite coast.
Mother's Day is actually on the 13th, not the 11th. I will be the first in my family to graduate with a bachelor's degree the day before Mother's Day. I couldn't think of a better gift to give my mother, who is currently back in school finishing her bachelor's, which she resumed after my younger brother started college. I'm very proud of her for working on finishing her degree after so many years taking care of us
Very thought provoking blog Katie…I find myself somewhere in the middle of ALL of this! I have a son that's 26 still at home (struggling/recovering drug adduct), 25 yr old twin daughters (one married-one on her own) and each relationship is SO different. We are all very close and see or talk daily. I lost my mom to breast cancer when I was 19 yrs old, so I have made it a priority to be there for them no matter what. I believe that as their mom (we) have a sixth sense and instinctively know which one's needs we should cater to or not. As I often say to them "you will always be my child (baby) no matter how old you are"…..but this is usually after giving advice they don't want to hear at the time—ha-ha! Seriously, each day brings something different whether it's advice given or just a listening ear…it 's all good with each stage of their lives because I get to be their mom!
whoo! Guess i SO dont fit the grid. I've worked as a NP, mostly full time, for the last 15+ years; both my parents are gone, and i joke about having the perfect mother in law (she's 5000 miles away and speaks no English). In addition, my older daughter is 12 and, at the age of 50, adopted my second child who has some special needs; she's now 6. My slightly younger husband and i acknowledge the fact that younger dear daughter probably wont have meddling parents for her kids b/c we will probably be dead. So i am parenting school aged kids at a time that may of my contemporaries have grandkids. Guess that makes me immature, and not particularly able to relate to this somehat icky ad campaign!
Kids leaving home and never returning died with Gen X.
Gen Y-ers, like myself, are notorious boomerang kids, and the newer generation is poised to be even worse.
I totally agree. They blame it on the bad economy, but the truth is, if you ask any of the Millennial Generation, they don't have any desire to move out because their Helicopter Parents cater to their every need and they are totally comfortable. They can have their dates stay the night, get all their bills paid, and free food and clothes. Why would they want to move out? They are not even interested in the College Campus Dorm Life, because now they can drink and have sex at home so a dorm isn't necessary!
My oldest is looking at colleges, but I still have a kid in junior high. However, I do have friends whose youngest kids getting ready to leave the nest. One friend, specifically, has been a good role model. She is planning for the time (this fall) when her youngest leaves for college the way mental health professionals tell you to plan for any big transition. For example, there is tons of advice about how to plan for retirement so that you don't wind up depressed and bored and missing your old life but rather, have created new hobbies or interests and ultimately a new life that is great.
The friend I mentioned is planning a trip to India as soon as she and her husband drop off their kid at college. They are documentary film makers, so the extended trip will have some business attached for structure, but will be mostly for pleasure. I bet they will return as happy empty nesters, having given themselves something else to focus on rather than the empty space their son used to inhabit before he went and grew up..
I have 2 sons who have a 7 year age difference. My oldest will graduate from college in December. When he left for school, it was hard but got easier as we all adjusted. I was so worried about crying when we moved him into the dorm that I didn't even consider how my youngest would feel. I did great but he cried saying he couldn't believe he would never live with his brother again. Now however, when my oldest is home, he comes in and expects to be top dog again and that doesn't play so well with my youngest (who will be starting high school in the fall). My oldest is great to text or call every few days just to say hello. And I have no time to meddle as I have become part of the sandwich generation. We bought the house next door for my Mom to be near by as she grew older but unfortunately she developed Lewy Body Alzheimer's and this is the hardest stage of life I've experienced so far. My MIL lives next door now but we call her Gladys Kravitz! She always seems to know what's going on over here! BTW, my neighbor used to call her son's college advisor all the time. She said she felt like she spent so much money on tuition that she was entitled!
My mom, who will be 70 this year, is as involved as ever in our lives. I talk with her daily. She also picks up my younger two children a couple of times per week and spends one afternoon a week with my youngest. I work from home so her help enables me to put in a couple of longer days in order to fulfill my hours. There is a lot of contact there and she is never shy to offer her opinions into my life. Sometimes at 41 this feels like an intrusion, other times I realize I am an adult and can walk away from it.
My oldest son is almost 19 and this is his first year at school. He will be returning for the summer in a few weeks to work and then return to classes in August. It has been a HUGE adjustment for me to let him go, and sometimes when I am letting go he asks me to hold tighter. He says he needs my input in a more vital way than he ever has. In some ways I agree with him. This is the biggest step they take, this flying from the nest, and some kids don't have the confidence or living skills to do it with ease. I try to offer him help without being a crutch and, I hope, it's working.
I always found it very strange that young adults in the US "move out" of the family home at 18-19 when off to college. Sure, they are away for the school year, but what of the summer? I went to college and university myself (OK, my country is tiny in comparison to the US, the 3 hrs bus travel was considered as far away for my college), I went home nearly every weekend, as it was cheaper, simpler and we all needed it. Summers I spent at home for the same reasons. I would have been very offended if my parents expect me to move out, as I'm an adult now. After college I moved 2000 kms away to a different country. Since then I have a family and life here. Still, I have daily contact with them, I travel home to them 3 times a year, especially since I have a child, and I wish for them to be near me every single day. I miss the "hovering" (they did hover, despite the fact that they both work full time and they always did all my life, but they never hovered too much, I found it rather sweet than annoying), I miss and need the involvement, and the possible help they could offer. My in laws live not 20 mins away from us, they offer no help (I wouldn't even feel safe to ask for any, they are unreliable and don't know anything about their grandchild), they see us maybe 5 times a year, that including Xmas and birthdays and such. I find it sad.
I had to smile at the lines about mommies taking care of their sick child well into their 30ies – this is what happened to me in March, we were on holidays at my parent's and I fell sick, they took care of my child for me and my mom pampered me as she used to when I was a child. It felt GREAT!
This whole thing seems to be a tradition in our family, my granny is a real helicopter lady, all her 3 very gown up children react to it differently (either put up with it, hate it or need it), my mom is a lovable and loving hoverer, and I plan to be the same: being there all the time, offering whatever help is needed, hoping it is needed and hoping to know where and when to stop and let my child be.
I've already commented, but would like to add: I have an overbearing mother. I told my husband that when she dies the tears at the funeral will be because we were never friends.
ok that being said…..I have a 24, 23 and 20 year old. All but the 23 year old are out of the nest. The middle child is a little slower at flying, but we are working with her and I expect she will be ready shortly.
Due to my over bearing mother, I tend to over-compensate and I just do not hover. I'm here if they need me, I offer suggestions, but I really believe that they would prefer to handle their own life. In my opinion there is a difference in helping and hovering……hovering doesn't teach anything. I'm against that even in the young kids. This is life….
My whole goal when parenting was to raise kids who could someday stand on their own. I'm almost there!
I see no hovering in my future. I feel like I understand the animal mothers who start snarling at their kids to let them know it's time to grow up and move on! My mother hovers and worries even though she works full-time. I am an out-of-sight-out-of-mind kind of person. I am fairly certain that when my kids are gone I will be happy to see them when they visit but I won't have them on my mind constantly when they don't. I agree with other posters above though that hovering mothers are not going away and from what I can see, aided by cell phones and social media, they are getting worse.
I love your analogy to the snarling animal mother. I see myself there!
I left home at 18 and felt I got very little 'mothering' from my mother after that – and actually, before that too. I wish she had been more involved with me. I don't think there should be an artificial cut-off for that kind of closeness. I'm 56 and my only child is 12. I'm hoping he'll live at home for as long as he likes. Having become a mother at a late age, I'm in no hurry to be without him again.
My youngest is J's age, amd my two older kids (one in college locally, one not) are not going anywhere anytime soon. The days when one could afford a ratty apartment with friends on what one could earn working part-time in college, seem to be long gone.
I don't anticipate my oldest, in particular, ever moving out, but he's pleasant and helpful and a considerate roommate, so I don't see the urgency, either.
What made the biggest difference for me was one kid finally getting a driver's license! The most challenging part of motherhood for me, besides the general terror at being responsible for these people not turning into serial killers, and just managing the mental organization (who needs a tetanus booster? which one doesn't eat cottage cheese? who has to have a red shirt for Friday?) … was the logistics, the driving in particular. Now that the busiest kid drives herself to practices and meetings and so forth all over town, I have an infinite amount of free time. I actually can have a quiet evening at home doing housework more than once a week for the first time *ever*.
Other than cooking, laundry and listening to tales of woe and triumph, and getting kids to medical and dental appointments, there isn't necessarily all that much I really *do* as a parent … they run their own lives and schedules these days. Meanwhile, my work and studies and social life have been able to ramp up to fill the space once occupied by potty-learning and singing Itsy Bitsy Spider.
My mom hovered when we were kids, but did so resentfully — as if she'd much rather be on the beach with a novel and a margarita but she *had* to keep watch over us because we were bound to screw up otherwise.
I love this conversation. I'm an only child, and I was my mom's best friend. She never really got over my growing up and moving out. She was quite resentful during my college years, my early marriage years were uncomfortable for her, and she still wants long, uninterrupted times to chat about nothing on the phone (can't do that, Mom, not right now). BUT she and I have never been closer. She has really tried over the years to stand on her own two feet socially and not lean on me so much as her sole source of emotional support. And I've been a lot stronger with my boundaries. She's an incredible support to me, even though, in some ways, I'm more mature than she is.
This is a big part of my relationship with my kids, especially my daughter, who's very much like I was as a child. Very easy going and empathetic, and accommodating to a fault. She could easily become a vessel into which I pour my unfulfilled needs, and I just won't let that happen. Hopefully I'm finding the right balance there…sharing a lot of my true self with her (including my imperfections and wants) but letting her know very clearly that it's my job to address, not hers.
I think that mom stereotypes are such easy pickin'. In the same way that mothers always die at the beginning of Disney movies. We just need to recognize them for what they are — caricatures, nothing more.
I taught my daughter to prepare for college and a job and she is very successful and I am very proud. Being a single mom with only one child, I was afraid I would be devastated when she left home so I prepared for it. I spent time with friends and on myself and she was astonished when I gave up control over her life. We're very close but don't have to talk every day. She help with a non-profit cancer fundraising organization and has great friends, some from elementary school. As I say, I'm proud that I was a strong mom and get to enjoy the fruits of my labor!
As an adult child of a meddling mother, I think technology has made it easier for mothers to keep parenting heavily (interfering/not letting go) when children have left home. My daughter is 4 (I'm 27) and if my mother weren't living 800 miles away she would be visiting at least weekly. A factor for her is that she wasn't a mom until age 36 and basically quit her career to stay home (always meaning to go back but not really attempting a full-time re-entry until I left for college) so at her age, there's little chance of getting a job in her field. She's a textbook helicopter parent and I don't think that will ever stop. My spouse's mom was never such a helicopter parent and while she participates in our life now, she doesn't try to intrude and when told to back off (like on some parenting choice we've made that she disagrees with) she actually does so (as opposed to my mom who keeps warning my daughter about how she shouldn't say hello to strangers despite being told not to keep scaring her several times). The boomerang kid phenomenon is also a factor but I think that just having so many generations around means who does the caring gets muddled (my grandmother is alive in her late 80s, my mom in her 60s, I occasionally care for them both and they both care for my daughter on occasion). My goal is to have a kid who is self-sufficient to leave once and stay gone if she likes, but to be welcoming enough that she can come back if she wants. I'm hoping to establish weekly calls as the norm so she isn't intruding into my life (yep, already planning my selfish reduced momming) and she's also forced to move into her own without me holding her hand all the time.